HPAC Finances $176,000...

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Martin
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HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Martin » Tue Mar 27, 2018 7:20 am

(Posted over on the HPAC/ACVL Yahoo Forum... as a favor could somebody copy and past over on the HPAC/ACVL F-Book page.... ? Tks)


In “my” ongoing effort to try and get members to reflect on the finances and operation of our HPAC/ACVL I would like to present some basic HPAC/ACVL financial numbers …..

The HPAC/ACVL is closing in on 1100 members for the 2018-2019 budget. Each member will pay $160.00 for a full membership (provincial memberships not included). This means, for the 2018-2019 budget the HPAC/ACVL will take in $176,000 in gross revenue from the membership.

There are some basic financial obligations (expenses) that come right off the top of this revenue. These expenses are more or less fixed and represent “core obligations” (tho admittedly some may not agree that these core numbers are reasonable but….). For simplicity, I will round these expenses out and base them on the 2017-2018 published budget:

- $40,000 Insurance
- $45,000 Current Executive Director compensation (includes operational costs)
- $13,000 Annual Directors meeting (over $17,000 in previous years)
- $7,000 Aero Club of Canada

Core obligations = $105,000 ( or $95 per member)

The remaining portion of the budget ($71,000, or $64 per member) is forecast to be consumed by legal, translation, competitions, Safety and the never ending Web site saga. The 2017-2018 budget forecasts a profit (this “profit” will only put a very small dent in the losses of the previous years and worthy of note is last years massive increase in dues that helped balance this years dues).

I would like the members to reflect on the basic numbers, I would like the membership to consider what they expect or want from their national association.

Perhaps what we have here meets expectations?

Perhaps nobody cares or even wants to know where their membership dues are going?

Maybe… we just want to go flying? Perhaps that’s our biggest issue… we simply don’t care enough and we get the administration or association we deserve?

In my opinion, I feel the HPAC/ACVL is overreaching its membership wishes and is trying to be something that most of the members do not support. I would hope that the membership would at least take the time to consider how much of your dues are simply consumed and would support some form reasonable financial accountability.

I have posted elsewhere that without accountability the HPAC/ACVL is more then able to consume what ever we give “it”. Personally, I’m asking the directorship to get our budget back under control and dramatically reduce our expenses and ultimately reduce our membership fees. An organization this small (IMO) should not be this expensive to maintain, especially given the meager services we receive in return.

Please consider your membership dues and start asking the hard questions as to what you expect from “your” national association.

Also…..

Remember, the people that step up and act as directors for your association deserve respect for taking on these thankless volunteer positions. They do not need to berated or chastised for not acting in “your” interests if you have not bothered to communicate your wishes. Many times they work without any input from “you” the members because “you” do not communicate…

Thanks

Martin Henry
HPAC/ACVL #02
(Past HPAC/ACVL President)

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Suntan » Fri Apr 06, 2018 2:55 pm

I fully agree. The Kite surfing society in Squamish has more members.... The hemorrhaging of funds has not been solved. Something needs to change! We have an awesome board right now. Let's not lose them all!

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Martin
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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Martin » Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:58 am

I'm a little surprised that there has not been a little more interest in this topic. Seems there are on a few vocal members that seem to think the HPAC has acted irresponsibly with our membership fees.

My personal objections have been the HPAC's focus on paper an not people and expansion of "Fixed" administrative costs. The members are responsible for this, not the board. The reason I suggest the members are responsible is because we "the members" have been negligent in our supervision of the board.

So, in my opinion, our lack of supervision (or apathy) has left the board to act as it sees fit (so... I don't get too excited about what the board has or has not done. I've been there, volunteers simply do what they see is best if nobody gives them any direction).

Given the members disinterest in the administration of "their" association it is no wonder we have found ourselves paying the present Executive Directors compensation rate of $37,800 and to my knowledge, we have never been presented with request from the board to alter the original assigned rate of compensation for this position ($18,900).

The directors did accept a proposal to double this compensation of the Executive Director for a defined period of two years to implement a in depth organizational renewal (Implementation of our current SOP's). At the end of the two year period, the doubled compensation was to end (as best as I can tell, sometime in the 2015-2016 fiscal cycle). For undetermined reasons, or a failure by the board to understand the agreement of the doubled compensation, it was not corrected and or assessed with a performance evaluation and or officially renewed.

The current board needs to correct this agreement and revert to the original terms of $18,900, then present the members with options as to if the Executive Director compensation is to be adjusted (to annual inflation rate and or a re-assessed compensation package reflecting a newly defined ED job description).

I know this stuff causes people to fall asleep or pass out with boredom, everybody just wants to go flying. Thing is, having an association that does what ever it wants and has morphed into something that serves itself more then it serves its members can't be a good thing.

All I'm asking the members to consider is this....

In BC, your going to spend $175 to join the HPAC. You will get a liability insurance program that has an actual per-member cost of $40 (and has essentially remained unchanged for almost 10 years?).... The remainder of your money is consumed by administration and bureaucracy. You are not receiving a news letter, you do not have a functioning web site and worse you (the members) do not appear interested.

Martin Henry
HPAC member #02

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby AlexR » Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:09 am

Well Martin for real interest maybe you have to post on FB or Line? The WCSC forum just doesn't seem to be very popular anymore.

I'd have to agree that HPAC does seem to have very high fixed costs for an organization of barely over a 1000 people. And with no disrespect meant to Margit I had no idea the Executive Director's compensation had moved up from 20 grand to almost 40. That's a lot. I know many full time employees who make less than that.

Many of the biggest benefits, launches, I use all the time have been provided mostly by my local club and the volunteer labour and enthusiasm. Canada Rasp and the Canadian airspace checker get used by lots of pilots and by many other users outside freeflight. I'd like to see them get some support, as far as I know they get zero HPAC or BCHPA money right now.

Say your piece folks, the Annual Directors Meeting is coming up. And I know that the hard working volunteer HPAC directors are listening. Please be constructive. In general I think HPAC does a good job and there are other countries where the costs are way higher (Australia). If you know anyone in the local club or HPAC you realise they do a lot of hours, get a lot of emails, and sometimes receive only uniformed criticism. I think it's important for members to be involved and have input to keep the organisation moving in the right direction.
Alex HPAC #2446

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby the other martin » Sun Apr 29, 2018 7:05 am

I happen to be one of the apathetic ones. However Martin may not be right on that point. It may appear pilots are apathetic wherein fact they may not see the relevance of HPAC in their flying lives. I would say the only reason I belong to HPAC is because of the insurance a pilot is required to have. Alex has raised some very good points. The local pilots have a greater understanding of what is needed and how to provide for the requirements. Launches, maintenance, RASP, airspace. etc. HPAC's purpose would be better suited to dole out the cash to the locals who know where it's needed. I check several flying sites on a daily basis. They are current and they serve a purpose for my needs. I am sorry to say HPAC doesn't. Re-evaluating the role HPAC should play in the flying community may be a better approach to spending $176,000.00. Top down management doesn't appear to be working whereas bottom up is showing great results.

Now if only it was sunny I would be out flying as opposed to spending time on yet another website.


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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Bruce » Tue May 01, 2018 1:57 pm

Sorry gotta weigh in here. Anyone who thinks 40Gs for an executive director of this circus is too much is out to lunch. You simply can't get anyone remotely qualifed for any less.

This is not a bunch of kiteboarders, it is aviation and it requires a slightly different approach.

Yeah Martin (s) back in the day it was cheaper. Can't wait to see your press release when you find out that a Big Mac now costs 4 bucks.

There may be some issues around the website costs. So run for office and fix it.

The whole gong show requires good management front to back or we'll end up like USHPA - uninsurable.

Oh and membership openly criticizing the executive directors compensation on a public forum is getting pretty damned close to an expensive contructive dismissal case. Now THAT can be expensive. So keep public discussions away from the ED, her performance, compensation and job duties.

Kudos Margit. It is an act of charity that you're still hanging in.

Bruce.

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby tnankie » Wed May 02, 2018 9:27 pm

Maybe the reason many people are indifferent to this issue because they realise that membership dues are a pittance of what they spend on a years flying.
wing ~ $500+ a year
Harness ~ $100 a year
Reserve 60-100 a year
Travel to the Fraser valley $40+ per day.
Tom Dupree
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my user name @ gmail . com

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Tim P » Thu May 03, 2018 5:38 pm

Here is a small bit of updated information in regards to HPAC's finances. There will be more to follow soon (in June).
This # of $176,000 should really be retired going forward as it has no connection to expenses at HPAC.

In the budget for 2017/18 which was approved by HPAC members at the last AGM in Sept 2017, the total expenses for the year ended March 2018 were estimated to be $153,324. The results for the year that has just ended are now in, and for a variety of reasons the actual expenses for the year were $28,583 lower than estimated in the budget. The expenses for the year ended March 2018 were therefore a reasonable $124,741.

Full details will be available for discussion at HPAC's upcoming AGM in June, and this will take place as usual on HPAC's forum, so standby for that.

Tim Parker
HPAC Treasurer

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Martin
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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Martin » Thu May 03, 2018 8:00 pm

Tim P wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 5:38 pm
This # of $176,000 should really be retired going forward as it has no connection to expenses at HPAC.

Tim Parker
HPAC Treasurer
Thanks Tim, so can we assume the HPAC will retire the present membership rate of $160 ? :wink:

After all if we have expenses of $124,000 why would we need to generate an income of $176,000? Or is intended to rebuild multiple budget deficits from previous years?

Martin

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Martin » Fri May 04, 2018 8:05 am

Bruce wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 1:57 pm
Sorry gotta weigh in here. Anyone who thinks 40Gs for an executive director of this circus is too much is out to lunch. You simply can't get anyone remotely qualifed for any less.
Bruce, thanks for weighing in... I wish more would do the same.

I was just heading out for lunch when I saw your post... Can't really say if 40G's is good or bad, someplace way back in time we took a temporary position intended to handle the basic administration of our little organization... you know, lick stamps, answer E-mail, forward stuff to the directors... and turned the position into a full time posting. Seems like we have gone from being self reliant to becoming totally dependent on the position of one person to do all of our work.
This is not a bunch of kiteboarders, it is aviation and it requires a slightly different approach.
Yah, if we say we are really important we must be important? We can print up stacks of SOP's, run a full time office and I can assure you, the government will still see us as a bunch of "kiteboarders"... btw... what do you have against kiteboarders?
Yeah Martin (s) back in the day it was cheaper. Can't wait to see your press release when you find out that a Big Mac now costs 4 bucks.
Yes, life has gotten more expensive. The Big Mac example has really hit the "Other Martin" hard... so much so I think he has switched to Filet-O-Fish (you might need to read the incident reports to get that little jab....) Funny thing about our HPAC costs, Insurance has not gone up (tho we have given up coverage). One could argue that our insurance costs have actually gone down on a per member value.
There may be some issues around the website costs. So run for office and fix it.
I'm still trying to figure out my Fax machine and you want me to run a web page? Tell you what, send me $20,000 and I will make you a web page... yah, really...
The whole gong show requires good management front to back or we'll end up like USHPA - uninsurable
.

First its the kiteboarders and now its slagging the USHPA? Insurance is all about profit. Yup, they are a litigious bunch down south but even when their underwriter bailed on them they did manage to "self insure" ... can't imagine our meager 1000 HPAC members being able to pull that off (not without joining the kiteboarder's to boost our numbers).

You should keep in mind two things... the HPAC could become "uninsurable" in the blink of an eye..... that's the insurance business. The other thing is our insurance is no good in the excited states, a perk we had to give up to remain insurable.
Oh and membership openly criticizing the executive directors compensation on a public forum is getting pretty damned close to an expensive contructive dismissal case. Now THAT can be expensive. So keep public discussions away from the ED, her performance, compensation and job duties.
Yikes, so now I have to afraid about publicly critiquing the HPAC administration? My only criticism of the ED is the position and its ever expanding definition. In addition, are ever increasing expense and reliance on a single individual to run the whole show. The HPAC is a little "club" trying to be something bigger than it is.

Margit has done a great job... the problem is, Margit ain't going to be around forever and we (the HPAC) continue to build this reliance on a central ED. Given the recent information about the duties of the ED we have created a position that is underpaid... Without Margits charitable donation of time, who will do this for free in the future? Our reliance on this paid position will force us to go to the market place where we will really have to buck up.

My real gripe with the HPAC is less about the ED and more about the fact "it" is not providing member services and not communicating anything of value. "It" should at least try to produce a news letter (E or otherwise) that communicates something about flying and less about SOP's and wonderful pipe dreams about how great "It" is.... Gee... produce a news letter? just like the days when I was the Emperor (I was a nasty prezz... could never really get attached to this democracy thing....)

Anyway, thanks for your "jumping in" ! Think I'll head off to McD's and join the other Martin for a Felit-O-Fish or one of them $4 Big Mac's!

Cheers

Comrade Martin

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Bruce » Fri May 04, 2018 11:48 am

Thanks Martin I love the thrust a parry of a good duel of wits even if I occasionally get run through. The facts also seem to include that volunteerism is dead. That publications,websites, government relations, media relations, etc aren't done by volunteers anymore. Also in every area of management, risk mitigation, and communication the bar has moved way way up. We simply live more in a world of expensive experts. It is not going to change. The work that has been done in government relations in sites and regulation, in media relations around fatal accidents, etc simply could not be done even remotely as well by someone who doesn't have the current EDs experience and education. I know whereof I speak since I do similar work and generally charge way way more.

As to kiteboarders, when was the last time they killed a student or passenger or forced IFR commercial aircraft to change course in class C airspace?

On the compensation job duties and performance issues good manners let alone tort law would suggest that ALL of those concerns go to HPAC reps. Not public forums.

Thanks Martin. And thanks for everything you've done for all of us for 40 years or do.

Bruce.

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby the other martin » Sat May 05, 2018 7:07 am

What's a Filet-O-Fish?

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Ihor » Sat May 05, 2018 8:00 am

Fried cat food patty. Only us old folks would understand. Cats, of course, are deeply offended.

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Re: HPAC Finances $176,000...

Postby Tim P » Sat May 05, 2018 5:19 pm

Hi Martin:

The current membership fee of $160 was set by the board when they met in May 2016, based on information available at that time, and since that time there have been some improvements in terms of the growth in the sport/increased membership levels, and a decrease, for now, in some of the expenses which HPAC does not directly control such as legal fees, so it would make sense for the board to review the situation at the end of 2018 to determine whether any possible adjustment to membership fees is warranted for 2019 and beyond.

Finally, without wanting to launch (no pun intended) into a lengthy debate here - I would save that for next month's AGM over at the HPAC Forum, I would just add that you are totally correct in that insurance is roughly the same or slightly lower than it was 10 years ago, but this affordable level of insurance did not just happen on its own, a reason why the insurance cost is where it is and has not impacted membership fees right now is the work that HPAC has been doing to self-regulate the sport in today's environment, and there have been costs associated with this work.

Tim Parker
HPAC Treasurer


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