Looks like the best option is to just close the road, decommission it (Tank Trap the road) and block all vehicle access. Everybody walks in. This way we don't have to get any permission from anybody. Its not a FSR (it our trail and we can return it to its original condition). Everybody good with that?
Cheers
Martin
Road to Woodside Launch....
-
the other martin
- Posts: 177
- Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:57 pm
- Location: Chilliwack
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
The only problem is the motorized folks will just create new trails around the decommissioned road and create considerable more damage to the area.
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
Seriously?... there is no viable way in with the road at the entry to the hump removed. We tank trapped the slope up to launch, it worked. We post it, we close it.
Martin
Martin
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
After my last post on this topic, I took a little time off to assess if there was any point trying to get the WCSC and the community to step up and take action to preserve the site.
If you have not followed the thread, the general ideas being kicked around were to close the road into launch, cut off public vehicle access (to reduce the damage done to the site), at the same time, shorten and build a quality trail to launch.
I’ve pretty much concluded it’s time to toss in the towel, the WCSC (and our flying community) is not capable of administering the task.
The WCSC, as the founding administration for the site no longer maintains a site strategy. The club lacks any core goals, or at least goals focused on site management that is shared or driven by our community. It’s not the fault of the directors, they do what they feel is enough to get by, but without support and direction from the community they are without any mandate to act on anything. Truly, not a surprise as our “community” is a tiny and dividing into smaller and smaller tribes.
The task of administering this site, under the pressures of urban growth and real-estate values is monumental and way beyond the our little collection of eclectic freaks and social misfits.
The founding Hang Gliding community has become redundant. The glory years are over and only few dedicated pilots remain. The Hang Gliding community is no longer capable of putting in the effort, nor does it have the capability to recruit the support needed to manage this urban flying site.
The Paraglider pilots (the majority of the club) are ambivalent to the needs of the Hang Gliding community and having even less attachment to anything permanent or sustainable.
For more than 45 years I have had the pleasure flying this wonderful Fraser Valley Hang Gliding site. The last proper Hang Gliding friendly site in the lower mainland. I’ve done my best to inspire Woodside’s preservation, but the flying community seems indifferent. Most appear caught up in the “next” flight and not the flight next year and or the flight for the “next” pilot.
So, I’m done with my “bitching an moaning” (to the relief of many I’m sure)…. Just want to say thanks to the fantastic Duncan’s (and family) for all those years of putting up with us flying “mooches” and THANKS to Mother Woodside (Kweh Kwuch Hum) for all of that fantastic airtime.
(Kind of like watching the last dump truck haul away "Point of the Mountain".... that's life
)
Cheers
Martin Henry
If you have not followed the thread, the general ideas being kicked around were to close the road into launch, cut off public vehicle access (to reduce the damage done to the site), at the same time, shorten and build a quality trail to launch.
I’ve pretty much concluded it’s time to toss in the towel, the WCSC (and our flying community) is not capable of administering the task.
The WCSC, as the founding administration for the site no longer maintains a site strategy. The club lacks any core goals, or at least goals focused on site management that is shared or driven by our community. It’s not the fault of the directors, they do what they feel is enough to get by, but without support and direction from the community they are without any mandate to act on anything. Truly, not a surprise as our “community” is a tiny and dividing into smaller and smaller tribes.
The task of administering this site, under the pressures of urban growth and real-estate values is monumental and way beyond the our little collection of eclectic freaks and social misfits.
The founding Hang Gliding community has become redundant. The glory years are over and only few dedicated pilots remain. The Hang Gliding community is no longer capable of putting in the effort, nor does it have the capability to recruit the support needed to manage this urban flying site.
The Paraglider pilots (the majority of the club) are ambivalent to the needs of the Hang Gliding community and having even less attachment to anything permanent or sustainable.
For more than 45 years I have had the pleasure flying this wonderful Fraser Valley Hang Gliding site. The last proper Hang Gliding friendly site in the lower mainland. I’ve done my best to inspire Woodside’s preservation, but the flying community seems indifferent. Most appear caught up in the “next” flight and not the flight next year and or the flight for the “next” pilot.
So, I’m done with my “bitching an moaning” (to the relief of many I’m sure)…. Just want to say thanks to the fantastic Duncan’s (and family) for all those years of putting up with us flying “mooches” and THANKS to Mother Woodside (Kweh Kwuch Hum) for all of that fantastic airtime.
(Kind of like watching the last dump truck haul away "Point of the Mountain".... that's life
)Cheers
Martin Henry
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
Martin, (and all)
I do not think there is a lack of interest in the problem,
I think it is more of a lack of viable solve all solutions.
I have had some thoughts on the issue. but nothing that would be very viable.
the threat of vandalism to parked vehicles, fires and mayhem at launch, percieved retribution for gating the road by off roaders....
How does one address all the issues to be addressed?
improve the road and you have dozens if not hundereds of tourists up there for the view and for sunsets and to watch us fly.
Put in a bigger parking lot and you invite more people in.
Gate the road and you develope a problem... everyone needs a key/combination and the lock/gate would be be target for vandalism.
Foot path from before hump (and gate/tank trap)... leaves our vehicles well out of site and targets for mischief. Plus numerous walks back and forth to carry gear. Being in my early 60's, my knees, lower back and feet are not what they used to be and I know I am not the only one. This "solution" also requires making room for parking.
I was half serious when I suggested on a facebook site that we develop a second more attractive road for the off roaders to use, but that still leaves the amazing view from launch that probably attracts most of the problems.
What is the most important issue and how do we make it work?
Keep in mind that the most important issue might be a bit different for different pilots.
Is there a workable solution?
I do not think there is a lack of interest in the problem,
I think it is more of a lack of viable solve all solutions.
I have had some thoughts on the issue. but nothing that would be very viable.
the threat of vandalism to parked vehicles, fires and mayhem at launch, percieved retribution for gating the road by off roaders....
How does one address all the issues to be addressed?
improve the road and you have dozens if not hundereds of tourists up there for the view and for sunsets and to watch us fly.
Put in a bigger parking lot and you invite more people in.
Gate the road and you develope a problem... everyone needs a key/combination and the lock/gate would be be target for vandalism.
Foot path from before hump (and gate/tank trap)... leaves our vehicles well out of site and targets for mischief. Plus numerous walks back and forth to carry gear. Being in my early 60's, my knees, lower back and feet are not what they used to be and I know I am not the only one. This "solution" also requires making room for parking.
I was half serious when I suggested on a facebook site that we develop a second more attractive road for the off roaders to use, but that still leaves the amazing view from launch that probably attracts most of the problems.
What is the most important issue and how do we make it work?
Keep in mind that the most important issue might be a bit different for different pilots.
Is there a workable solution?
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
Road to launch is an issue but the looming issue that inevitably will develop is the loss of both Riverside and the HG field one day. I spoke with Kim Duncan some time ago and she said that Riverside may be for sale in the near future.
With the loss of FlyBC we must address the inevitable parking issues so that we don't lose the only two LZ's we have left sooner than later.
With the loss of FlyBC we must address the inevitable parking issues so that we don't lose the only two LZ's we have left sooner than later.
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
Hi all,
There's been some valuable discussion here, thanks to those who've contributed.
It's a very difficult issue, but I'm optimistic that we'll be able to find a workable solution. To be sure, there is a LOT of interest in keeping Woodside viable and our crown jewel site. Most people just don't voice (type?) that interest in this forum or on the internet. The problem isn't lack of interest, it's definitely a lack of someone dedicated to doing the hard work/time to see it through. For such a concentration of WCSC members, I'm surprised more people haven't volunteered to help out with this (not meaning to discount at all the volunteers who donate time and energy on the physical projects, like launch/lz maintenance, trails etc., I'm always amazed to see the efforts here).
What we (the club) needs is a knowledgeable, motivated, ambitious go-getter FV sites director to assess the feasibility of various options, plan and coordinate. Some great ideas have been proposed - we need people to move them forward. In other words, it's not just an ideas problem, it's an implementation problem.
The AGM is coming up, it's an excellent opportunity to get informed and involved, if anyone can volunteer for the FV sites role, please let me know!
Many thanks,
James
There's been some valuable discussion here, thanks to those who've contributed.
It's a very difficult issue, but I'm optimistic that we'll be able to find a workable solution. To be sure, there is a LOT of interest in keeping Woodside viable and our crown jewel site. Most people just don't voice (type?) that interest in this forum or on the internet. The problem isn't lack of interest, it's definitely a lack of someone dedicated to doing the hard work/time to see it through. For such a concentration of WCSC members, I'm surprised more people haven't volunteered to help out with this (not meaning to discount at all the volunteers who donate time and energy on the physical projects, like launch/lz maintenance, trails etc., I'm always amazed to see the efforts here).
What we (the club) needs is a knowledgeable, motivated, ambitious go-getter FV sites director to assess the feasibility of various options, plan and coordinate. Some great ideas have been proposed - we need people to move them forward. In other words, it's not just an ideas problem, it's an implementation problem.
The AGM is coming up, it's an excellent opportunity to get informed and involved, if anyone can volunteer for the FV sites role, please let me know!
Many thanks,
James
James Elliott
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
This is key! to be low key.the other martin wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 6:58 am When I lived on Vancouver Island our primary site was Mount Prevost. It was gated. The local forestry officer who was employed by the Municipality of North Cowichan/Duncan would lock the gate every summer. It would be locked by the end of June and remain locked until late summer. Done. We pilots didn't have a key nor were we given any leeway. The reasoning was 'fire hazard'. A monsoon wouldn't change his mind about a fire hazard. It was less work for him just to keep everyone off the mountain.
I would strongly recommend our club work with nature. Boulders, trenches, pathways, stiles, and any other natural impediment we could use to discourage vehicular traffic but yet encourage foot traffic.
Introducing other interested parties to the dance could be a curse more than a blessing. Presently we have an incredible launch and are the primary care givers. I think we should keep it that way and keep it low key.
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
I have avoided any further conversation on this forum and particularly the future of the site but, as "they say", I just can't help myself....
I saw in the last few comments the statement: "keep it low key".... Huh? Is this a suggestion that we should try and fly under the radar? Don't draw any attention? A little late for that when the club is now involved with a full blown commercial money venture on crown lands...
A little late to avoid drawing any attention when you've got 3000-4000 square feet of Black felt ground cover (that you can see from Space for crying out loud ), Your running a commercial shuttle transporting pilots, Commercial Tandem, Commercial Instruction. Throw in Social Media and good old visual exposure... ain't no sneaking this by anyone.
The club, if its doing its job is obligated to look after this gong show. It includes managing the road. Seems the biggest obligation, the main road up the mountain got taken care of by the Forest Harvest and FSR obligations (lucky the FSR obligations are picking up the tab on that one).
All the club is obligated to do is deal with a few hundred meters of road into launch. Of the over 40+years I've been flying this site we have managed to keep the road into launch passable for at least 35 of those years.
I suspect because the bulk of the members are now paraglider pilots who can hike there gear from where ever they can jam a parking spot they could care less about the needs of the Hang Glider pilots.
I doubt anything is going to happen this year, given the fact we are well into the season and we have likely blown club initiative to fix the mess . We certainly would not want to interfere with the full blown "low key" commercialization of poor old Mother Woodside.
Cheers
Martin
I saw in the last few comments the statement: "keep it low key".... Huh? Is this a suggestion that we should try and fly under the radar? Don't draw any attention? A little late for that when the club is now involved with a full blown commercial money venture on crown lands...
A little late to avoid drawing any attention when you've got 3000-4000 square feet of Black felt ground cover (that you can see from Space for crying out loud
), Your running a commercial shuttle transporting pilots, Commercial Tandem, Commercial Instruction. Throw in Social Media and good old visual exposure... ain't no sneaking this by anyone. The club, if its doing its job is obligated to look after this gong show. It includes managing the road. Seems the biggest obligation, the main road up the mountain got taken care of by the Forest Harvest and FSR obligations (lucky the FSR obligations are picking up the tab on that one).
All the club is obligated to do is deal with a few hundred meters of road into launch. Of the over 40+years I've been flying this site we have managed to keep the road into launch passable for at least 35 of those years.
I suspect because the bulk of the members are now paraglider pilots who can hike there gear from where ever they can jam a parking spot they could care less about the needs of the Hang Glider pilots.
I doubt anything is going to happen this year, given the fact we are well into the season and we have likely blown club initiative to fix the mess . We certainly would not want to interfere with the full blown "low key" commercialization of poor old Mother Woodside.
Cheers
Martin
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
As expected, the "Club" has done nothing to preserve/repair access to launch. (Should be noted that NONE of the road work up the mountain had anything to do with the Club... all FSR work by the logging operation, nothing more).
On my only visit this year, the spur road from the primary FSR has decayed to the point that only vehicles with serious off road capability will be able climb up and reach the turn to the club's trail to launch.
The grade to the last parking/loading area continues to decay and the last pitch down into the launch has become a hazard to both walk and or access by vehicle.
Commercial operators continue to pound the heck out of the access (hundreds of commercial tandems, shuttles and school operations). Come this fall the change in weather weather will likely give the 4x4 enthusiast the opportunity finish off the spur at the FSR turn off.
Hard to believe the Club's critical primary site was receiving any care or attention...About the only improvement noted was a new toilet seat and the door on the out-house might have been replaced.
Cheers
Comrade Martin
On my only visit this year, the spur road from the primary FSR has decayed to the point that only vehicles with serious off road capability will be able climb up and reach the turn to the club's trail to launch.
The grade to the last parking/loading area continues to decay and the last pitch down into the launch has become a hazard to both walk and or access by vehicle.
Commercial operators continue to pound the heck out of the access (hundreds of commercial tandems, shuttles and school operations). Come this fall the change in weather weather will likely give the 4x4 enthusiast the opportunity finish off the spur at the FSR turn off.
Hard to believe the Club's critical primary site was receiving any care or attention...About the only improvement noted was a new toilet seat and the door on the out-house might have been replaced.
Cheers
Comrade Martin
Re: Road to Woodside Launch....
Thanks to those who contributed to recent road work on Woodside. Thought I would post a link to a similar topic that goes hand in hand with issues associated with back country use (and abuse).
At Woodside the topic of a gate comes up in conversation to help reduce/control access to our launch. There is often statements kicked around suggesting it would be impossible and we would have no rights to install or control access on crown lands. Well I firmly believe our club lacks the maturity to manage such an endeavor, I find it quite funny that the much larger BC Four Wheel Drive Association of BC has several sites in the back country protected by gates or access control... Check out the plans for the Mission area:
https://fvcurrent.com/article/hayward-p ... e-offroad/
Cheers
Comrade Martin
At Woodside the topic of a gate comes up in conversation to help reduce/control access to our launch. There is often statements kicked around suggesting it would be impossible and we would have no rights to install or control access on crown lands. Well I firmly believe our club lacks the maturity to manage such an endeavor, I find it quite funny that the much larger BC Four Wheel Drive Association of BC has several sites in the back country protected by gates or access control... Check out the plans for the Mission area:
https://fvcurrent.com/article/hayward-p ... e-offroad/
Cheers
Comrade Martin